Post Game Thread - vs Suns, Home 1/18/20

[bobheckler]

These losses to shitty teams have to end or the beatings will continue.

We were missing 40% of our starting lineup, representing 42.1 ppg and about 40% of our offense. That makes it hard.

What also makes is hard is that Devin Booker sees his Yellow Brick Road to the HOF as going through Faneuil Hall. He is unreal.

Tommy pointed out last night that our top 7 players have only played 5 games together all season. Our injuries are taking a toll on the team's performance and conference standings. What's weird is that they aren't dramatic things like Hayward's ankle break or such. They're the flu running through the locker room, knee tendonitis but not knee injuries, sprained thumbs, viral conjunctivitis.

Marcus Smart is now the all-time Celtic leader for most 3t fgm in a game with 11. Words I never thought I'd ever say. 37 points on 13-25, 11-22 from 3. 8 assists and only 1 turnover. He did it all and was the only reason why this wasn't a complete blow out.

Tatum and Hayward were a combined 6-19, 15 points, at halftime. They were 10-28 after 3, a 4-9 3rd. They picked it up in the 4th, going a combined 18-40 for the game (8-12 in the 4th) but they had 6 of our 11 turnovers. This all bugs me because they knew, coming out of the locker room before the game, that we needed good starts from them and they didn't do it. Tatum was taking ME-ball shots, Hayward was taking turnaround fadeaways from the frito line, just poor basketball, and we went down 16 and had to pull ourselves up by our sneaker laces the rest of the way.

Ayton with a monster game. Really showed Kanter up. Theis, we know, isn't going to match up well against Ayton but Kanter should have.

Grant Williams was given a start because of the absence of Walker and Brown. What a waste. He did nothing, showed nothing. 13 minutes of nothing but 1 rebound and 3 fouls. Some of it was the refs blowing rookie fouls but a lot of it was him being outplayed.

I don't know what Brad and the coaching staff say to the players in the locker room before the game, but he might want to change it. These slow starts are killing us.

https://www.espn.com/nba/boxscore?gameId=401161270



bob


.

[cowens/oldschool]

Considering we were without 2 starters, I’m okay with this loss, team played hard for the most part. I’m fine with load management, other teams are doing it, if we have to sacrifice a few wins for a healthier better team down the road, fine. It worked for Kawhi, now he’s on a roll. The game is physical, we don’t need more broken down players. Don’t get me wrong, at first I abhorred it, but just like the wave of 3 ball took over this era years ago, if the top teams are sacrificing some wins for the health of their players, then I’d rather have healthy players too as we have young developing players, so why burn them out at such a young age?’You don’t have to win every game in the regular season, it’s more important to have the team healthy and strong and jelling come playoff time.

GH’s shot has been off, he’s going thru some foot issues that I’m sure is effecting his shot, but he’s playing thru it, and not asking for any time off, got to respect that. Jayson still growing into his body, he does look and play a lot stronger, had some great defensive plays and has throughout this season. I’m not gonna get on him for not dominating ALL the games more, he’s still 21 and way ahead of where Kawhi and PG were at the same age. I understand there’s only one Magic/Lebron/Luka that dominates at a baby age and that’s okay, he’s still on his way to being a multiple all star type 2 way clutch player, he’s just gonna take a few more seasons to get there.

Marcus Smart had a coming out party, kept us in the game and at times I thought he was too beat up by his style of play, that he shouldn’t try to do too much, guess he’s got more to his game/abilities than I thought. In this era it’s all who’s hotter from 3 a lot of times that dictates winning, they had more guys step up from 3 to pull it out.

[worcester]

Spot on Cow. We played well considering 40% of our starters were not on the floor. Marcus continues to impress me. What a stud. We are so lucky he is a Celtic. He continues to get better and better and better. What heart.

Notice how many games we lose to teams that have good centers?

Danny has to fix that.

Notice how ineffective Grant continues to be? He simply should not play the 5, and we are in trouble if we have to rely on him for many productive minutes anywhere ion offense. Danny, find someone else. Please. We need help.

Glad Gordon is coming back.

Jayson is developing well. Let's not put Luka type expectations on him. He's playing great for a 21 year old. Improving over last year. He's a foundation stone for our franchise.

[bobheckler]

Spot on Cow. We played well considering 40% of our starters were not on the floor. Marcus continues to impress me. What a stud. We are so lucky he is a Celtic. He continues to get better and better and better. What heart.

Notice how many games we lose to teams that have good centers?

Danny has to fix that.

Notice how ineffective Grant continues to be? He simply should not play the 5, and we are in trouble if we have to rely on him for many productive minutes anywhere ion offense. Danny, find someone else. Please. We need help.

Glad Gordon is coming back.

Jayson is developing well. Let's not put Luka type expectations on him. He's playing great for a 21 year old. Improving over last year. He's a foundation stone for our franchise.

Worcester,

I agree about Grant not playing 5. The problem is he didn't play 5 last night, he started 4, Theis was the 5. Grant didn't even show he could play 4.

Less than halfway through his rookie season, too soon to throw the baby out with the bathwater, but it'd be nice if he gave us more to crow about.


bob


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[kdp59]

I give Grant a  pass to be honest, he was the #22 pick in the draft. He's outplayed his draft spot .

our #14 pick cannot get on the floor most games, which is about right for a team that wants to be a contender.

I can't put  unrealistic expectations on the #22 pick in the draft and I don't think its fair for anyone to.

maybe the questions should fall to Ainge and why he built a team with only two NBA caliber big men on the roster?

anything Grant gives us is gravy based on his draft position.

[tjmakz]

Boston was without Kemba and Jaylen and Phoenix was without Oubre who is averaging over 18 ppg.
With Boston starting Jayson, Gordon and Marcus hitting 11 3 pointers, I would not have thought that Boston would lose to Phoenix at home.
Could Tacko not be a more effective 15-20 mpg center over Grant Williams?
Grant does not pass the eye test to me as an NBA rotation player.

[dboss]

Once again the Celtics got off to a slow start and found themselves playing from behind all night.

Marcus with a career night.  He is up to 35.5% for the year on 3's.  To put that into perspective JT is shooting 35.6% and GH is shooting 35%.

The impact of having key players missing has taken its' toll on the team.  We do not have the depth to play through that.

I like the overall configuration on this team but our ability to match the size, strength and athleticism of so many teams tempers my expectation.  Last night Saric and Ayton combined for 26 rebounds and 39 points while Theis and Kanter had 8 rebounds and 20 points combined.

The Celtic's front line is inadequate.  That will need to be fixed for Boston to become a truly elite team.

The experimentation of playing tweeners as bigs has failed miserably.  It is not working.

Our three wing lineup looks good but only when they can actually play together.  Injuries has hurt continuity.

Brad has yet to devise schemes to take away certain players.  Time and time again this team gives up career highs to guys that do not deserve them.  The team has yet to establish an identity, a brand, a style of play that defines them.  They are not great at anything in particular.  They are good at some things and not so good at others.

One thing should be clear to those not in need of corrective lenses.  This team is not in the same class as the Bucks or the Lakers.  The Celtics are among a group of several teams that reside in the 2nd tier in terms of quality.  However the Celtics are the only team among them with a weak frontline.  Indy, Sixers, Heat, Raptors all have stronger front lines.

I convinced myself that our 3 headed center would be enough because it was diverse.  Now I do not think so even with a healthy RWiii.  

We have a coach that is consumed with the notion of small ball at center being the equalizer for all things big.  There is no substitute for size.  

We are halfway through the season at 27-14 and we can pass out midterm grades.  Mark the report cards as you wish.  Overall the team has earned a solid B and that is the midterm grade I am giving them.

[tardust]

This was not so unexpected with the way we have been playing and missing two starters. The bench for the most part was non existent. I would look at Waters getting more regular time and let Wanny sit a little and see what happens. Wanny has really not played as well as he was at first of year.

Great game by Smart even though I don't like him getting that many shots. If they are going in I can live with it though. Tatum finished 10-20 from the field and 26 pts. Solid game again from him. Hayward played OK but his game has kind of slipped from before his first injury this year.

I think the ALL Star break will be good for a lot of our guys. Wouldn't bother me at all if only Walker makes the All Star game. That would probably add a little fire to both Tatum and Brown for the rest of this year and probably next.

While Tatum's defense has improved this year, Walker's has dipped from previous years. I hope he gets it back. He hasn't had a blocked shot this month and only 5 for the last two months. This isn't the Jaylen I remember on defense.

I have been preaching all year I have been concerned with our bigs, or lack of bigs if you will. We just don't have that guy that will get you blocks and rebounds every game. (yes I know Kanter has had a couple of big rebounding games, but he is not your starter answer)

Last but not least we play too much one on one ball. Its pretty much the whole team. We seem to get assists but they aren't the same kind you will see watching Buck, Dallas, etc. We make one pass and its usually taking on your man by yourself.

I go along with Dboss on the B grade. 3 weeks ago it would have been a A-

[wideclyde]

I see two major concerns when watching the Cs lately. Especially in the losses to these lesser teams.

Starting just about every game in a double digit disadvantage has got to change. With or without two starters last night, the starting lineup may need to be adjusted very soon. More energy and emergency must take place!

Second, the lack of any nightly scoring by the bench squad must also be adjusted. A trade or two could possibly solve this issue.

Perhaps, changing the starting lineup will help the early game intensity while also leaving some better offensive fire power for the second unit?

Not to just be a complainer--I suggest that Jaylen Brown be moved to the second unit to provide better offense for that group although it is certainly not his fault alone that the first unit falls behind in every first quarter.

[dboss]

Robbing Peter to pay Paul still leaves you with owing money.

The Celtics need to add a scorer.  The center situation is not likely to be resolved this year.  So be it.  Projections that Edwards or Grant or Langford would be able to give us that have faded.  Not this year anyways.  

Taking one of your best scorers and shooters out of the starting lineup will not help you be better in the first quarter.  What seems to be missing is early game execution and decision making.  We do not see sharp passing and guys seem to start off looking to break the ice.  Taking the first open look that is available instead of searching for a better scoring opportunity by passing the ball to a teammate.  The other teams scorers early and often and the Celtics start to press to find their rhythm.

This team has been decimated because so many key guys have been sick or injured.  The team simply needs to get healthy.  The team still appears to be in good spirits and they still have confidence in themselves.

[gyso]

"Tommy pointed out last night that our top 7 players have only played 5 games together all season."

Any other conclusions are moot. Our issues begin and end with our lack of continuity for our top rotation guys.

[NYCelt]

You need starters on the floor to win. Tough sledding lately when short key guys.

That and once again, play in the paint. That's where the Celtics are getting thumped. The shot chart most every game tells the story. We don't score in the paint. They do.

Nice shooting by Smart though.

Went to a wedding, so I have yet to watch the game. Maybe I'll just pass and catch a victory with the next one. Football conference title games today anyway. I'll give the kiss of death to Green Bay and KC. Would like to see that as a Super Bowl matchup.

[dboss]

"Tommy pointed out last night that our top 7 players have only played 5 games together all season."

Any other conclusions are moot.  Our issues begin and end with our lack of continuity for our top rotation guys.

This has certainly been our biggest issue.

[cowens/oldschool]

"Tommy pointed out last night that our top 7 players have only played 5 games together all season."

Any other conclusions are moot.  Our issues begin and end with our lack of continuity for our top rotation guys.

This has certainly been our biggest issue.  

+1

I think we’ll be okay, we keep on talking about our center issues, if RWill could have just stayed healthy and kept improving thru playing time, we’d have a versatile threesome, with our utopian wings and backcourt might have been ready for contending, butt that never played out. Him being the best version of himself could have been such an asset/force.

[dboss]

RW could be an x factor for us on the defensive end.  He is expected to return but Boston will not rush him back.  Brad has not had the benefit of having that trio available this season.

The rotations change and we have yet to get a take on what that looks like.

RW is going to return  after the Allstar break so we will see something.  The Celtics still need to draft a center in June.

[cowens/oldschool]

RW could be an x factor for us on the defensive end.  He is expected to return but Boston will not rush him back.  Brad has not had the benefit of having that trio available this season.

The rotations change and we have yet to get a take on what that looks like.

RW is going to return  after the Allstar break so we will see something.  The Celtics still need to draft a center in June.

Agreed, we could have used a big this past draft, this kid Gafford is starting to get playing time, he already looks like a bigger version of Theis.

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