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Celtics Wrap: Boston Bounces Back For Win Vs. Third-Seeded Cavaliers
Jaylen Brown scored 32 points as Boston is back to .500 on the season


NESN by Sean T. McGuire

The shorthanded Boston Celtics earned a bounce-back win Wednesday night against the Cleveland Cavaliers with a 111-101 verdict at TD Garden.

The 16-16 Celtics got back to .500 with the victory while the Cavaliers, who entered as the third team in the Eastern Conference, fell to 19-13.


ONE BIG TAKEAWAY
The Celtics, fresh off a loss to the Philadelphia 76ers in a game that both Jaylen Brown and Payton Pritchard said they wished they could have back, put together a solid effort on both ends and benefitted from the Cavaliers having an ice-cold shooting night. Boston took a 23-point lead in the third quarter, and while they (unsurprisingly) allowed the Cavaliers to come back, the Celtics, playing with seven in health and safety protocols, did enough down the stretch to pull out the win. It was a good bounce-back win after a game they should have had two nights prior.

The Celtics held the Cavs to 21.6% from long range (8-for-37) and 38.5% from the field all while turning 15 Cleveland turnovers into 17 points in transition.

STARS OF THE GAME
— Jaylen Brown put together a second straight 30-plus point game. Brown, who scored 30 against the Sixers, finished with 34 points on 12-for-22 from the field in 36 minutes. He added six rebounds, three assists, one block and one steal in the effort.


— Robert Williams stuffed the stat sheet in his return after missing Monday’s loss to the 76ers due to personal reasons. Williams finished with 21 points on 10-for-12 from the field with 11 rebounds, seven assists, two blocks and two steals.


— Darius Garland led the Cavaliers offensive end and was the only starter to score more than double figures. Garland finished with 28 points on 11-for-22 from the field with six assists and three steals.

WAGER WATCH
The Celtics were a 6.5-point favorite entering Wednesday, according to DraftKings Sportsbook, and while there were times it looked like Cleveland could come all the way back for a back-door cover — it was a 12-point game with three minutes left — the Celtics did enough to earn a win against the spread. For a bettor who took Celtics -6.5, a $110 bet would have earned a payout of $210.

UP NEXT
The Celtics will travel to Milwaukee for a Christmas Day matchup against the defending champion Bucks on Saturday. Tip off is set for 2:30 p.m. ET.

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Sometimes adversity brings out the best in players.   Being short handed in personnel is an easy way out for most teams, but the Celtics have shown some backbone in this period of time.

That being said, they are a flawed team that needs an overhaul in 3 specific areas.  

If I had a wish to begin with, I would choose #1 & #3 to start.

1) An elite point guard who is a distributor
2) A top center
3) Depth on the bench from 7-12

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We won, but I don’t think we played very well, but we were good enough overall. Jaylen looked good and obviously carried us, RWill came on after a shaky start where he couldn’t keep Tacko off the boards. Smart went 1-7, Schroder went 1-11, at what point does a player figure my shot is off, maybe I should stop? 6, 7, 8, 10 I don’t know what the answer is? I know Smart has games like this all the time, Dennis not so much, but he’s on a really bad streak right now. What also irks me with Dennis is even when he was hitting his shots, he’s always turning the ball over way too much.

Romeo looked like he belongs, very good rebounder and defender, finding his offense and has some intangibles. With no GWill and JRich, thought it was the perfect time to get Nesmith some minutes. We want to see growth in the J’s distributing/passing ability, they are making strides, but with flawed pieces like Dennis and Smart putting on bricking clinics….oh well you get the idea. Lucky Cavs were cold and not at full strength.

I decided to take a short break from here, was too invested to just watch the games objectively.

After watching a set of games, I don't buy any of the "Celts have potential talk." The Celts as a team are lacking flow and creativity and I am laying it on the two Js.

I am reaching a point where I will be OK to trade Jaylen Brown for a different high quality player that will be a better fit.

I am not that sold on Dame. He brings shooting to the table but not that creativity that enables chemistry.

Getting ready to suffer through another season, unless Brad pulls a rabbit out of the hat.

This game was very close to entering into the elite status of games won for the season but it still had its 3rd/Partial 4th quarter meltdown and its usual cast of character flaws highlighted above that are marking this team for the season.  

Of my monikers for this season's (and last season's for that matter) team, this week I'm liking the Forrest Gump (BTW, thanks to BobH for clearing this up for me, but I'd like to clarify and re-name the 2nd Verse Same As The First moniker to Herman's Hermits.  So the complete set is WOLOWOLT, Forrest Gump and Herman's Hermits until further notice)  one as this game really proved it here lately.  Should have won vs. 6ers but didn't.  Should have had our a$$e$ handed to us last night by one of the top 3 teams in the East but actually built a 25-point lead only to have 15 points shaved off of it by the end.  

If all indicators are correct, this implies we should beat the crap out of the Buck Saturday.  But alas, we will find ourselves Sunday morning back in the woulda, coulda, shoulda discussions...moral victories and all.  (Please!!  Prove me wrong!!  As you well know, I am very good at admitting and very willing to admit I'm wrong on this site!!)

We need to be 6-7 games above .500 by mid-January.  That's all in which I'm asking for Christmas!

db

prakash wrote:I decided to take a short break from here, was too invested to just watch the games objectively.

After watching a set of games, I don't buy any of the "Celts have potential talk."  The Celts as a team are lacking flow and creativity and I am laying it on the two Js.

I am reaching a point where I will be OK to trade Jaylen Brown for a different high quality player that will be a better fit.

I am not that sold on Dame.  He brings shooting to the table but not that creativity that enables chemistry.

Getting ready to suffer through another season, unless Brad pulls a rabbit out of the hat.

I beg to differ, the J’s are our strength, when they get rolling they can still carry us. The main problem is not enough talented shooters around them IMHO. There are some young pieces that could still evolve into bigger roles, we can still get there with 2 J’s.

I didn't watch the game, I had command performance at a Christmas party, but I'm watching the highlight films.  Not the same, I know, but beggars can't be choosers.

Boxscore observations:

1.  Tatum with another 6-19 night, 2-8 from 3.  His lack of consistency is irking me so I looked it up:  He is shooting almost 47% from the field, 34% from 3, in the last 10 games.  the 3pt fg% is weak, but better, but the 47% is quite good.  These stinkers look bad but his moving 10 game average looks ok.  I just wish I could exhale and relax.

2.  The Time Lord with a monster.  18 points on 10-12, 11 rebounds, 4 of them offensive, 7 assists and only 2 TOs, 2 blocks, 2 steals.  As complete a game as you can ask and much more than Tacko wanted.




3.  Tatum or Jaylen?  Looking like Jaylen as of right now.  The story on the Js was that Tatum was the scorer and Brown was the defender.  Not so true anymore.  By the end of the film I was actually starting to feel sorry for Markannen.  At first I was just thinking he was a terrible defender, and he is, but by the end it was clear he had no chance regardless.  Markannen, Valentine, Osman all tried.  




4.  I can't find Romeo highlights but 11 points on 5-8 and 9 rebounds is a solid outing statistically.  


5.  Schroder 1-11.  I looked up his Last 10 numbers to see if this game is representative of the bigger sample.  Closer than Tatum's.  He's shooting 40% and 32.4% from 3 in his last 10.  That's not 1-11 but it isn't particularly good.  I made some comments about Schroder vis-a-vis Pritchard on another thread that got a response from Cowens there and I'll answer it there.  


6.  ISO Joe giving the crowd a feel good moment.  Nice.  It was a tough shot too.

DBrown cited a "3rd/Partial 4th quarter meltdown".  Didn't watch the game, as I said, but we only lost the 3rd quarter by 3 points and lost the 4th quarter by 2.  That's 5 points off our lead in 24 minutes of play.  When I look at the boxscores of the players who only played the last 2 minutes (Justin Jackson, Bruno Fernando, Joe Johnson and CJ Miles) they were a -5.  That means our >3 possession 10 point victory was a 5 possession 15 point lead with 2 to go.  In fact, the score was 107-92 with 1:57.  Whatever meltdown we had in the 3rd and 4th wasn't enough to offset a large lead of ours.  Darius Garland got it down to 10 with 11:20 left in the 4th.  That was the closest it had been in the 2nd half, and the closest it would get for the rest of the game.  Complaining about having a 20+ point lead halved before building it back up to 15 and final garbage time is something one usually hears from spoiled Dub fans. We should be so lucky.

The Cavs were 19-12 coming in last night and are still tied with Miami for 4th and only .5 games behind Milwaukee for 3rd.  They are 7-3 in their last 10, which means they were 7-2 in their last 9 before last night's game.  They are having a great year.  They have the #2 defense, giving up only 101.4ppg.  We're so used to them being the Cleveland Cadavers we expect to beat them handily, but this is a different team this year.  A much better team.  I don't understand how or why but, if you are your record, they are.   When you score more than the 101.4ppg they give up and give up less than the 106.8ppg they score you've had yourself a good game.

https://www.espn.com/nba/boxscore/_/gameId/401360295




Bob


.

BobH,

All I know is we were up by 25 at one point somewhere in the 3rd quarter and we won by 10. 15 points came off somewhere! The lead deficit fell in the cracks. We were running away in the 3rd and then they shaved a bunch of points off to win the 3rd by 3. In the 4th we built it back up into the high teens then Ime pulled the plug almost too soon again inserting the scrubs.

db

Here's ISO Joe's shot.




Bob


.

Some general observations.

The Celtics won a game that they were supposed to win.

Both team had a lot of players missing due to the health and safety protocols.

JB is starting to really cook after missing a lot of games with his hamstring injury.

JT is driving to the rim quite a bit.  He is also making noticeable attempts to pass the ball to open teammates.

The value of RW goes far beyond his vertical athleticism and 70% + makes.  Last night his screens freed up a lot of guys for wide open looks.  Rob is an excellent screener.  He does not get called for a lot of offensive fouls.  

While the Jays have ISO skills to get shots off the purity of using screens enhances their ability to score.  There was a sequence of plays where Rob screened for Tatum where he scored twice.  Then he did the same for Jaylen and then for Payton Pritchard.

Dennis Schroeder is in a funky place.  I know he had a sprained ankle a few games back but that has little to do with his overall play.  Right now he looks like a guy who only cares about his touches.  He is lackadaisical. His decision making is horrible.  Maybe Ime told him that he is being shopped.  One thing seems apparent.  

PP is finally getting some minutes.  The more minutes he gets the less minutes are there for Dennis and with JB back and Langford and Nesmith getting more playing time there is virtually no SG minutes for Dennis.  Plus we got Josh.  Dennis has been our 3rd leading scorer all year but his inefficiency does not really make us a better team.  Please move him and move on.

Also I completely disagree with prakash as it relates to trading Jaylen Brown.  

Prakash you are laying the blame for what you refer to as flow and creativity on the Jays but you apparently think Jaylen is the one who should be traded.  You talk about fit but how can anyone know how a particular player will fit on this team or any team?

Flow and creativity should not be expected from either J.  That my friend is under the job description of a PG.  While I do think that the Jays need to continue to improve in moving the ball to teammates that cannot and will not be a primary function of either player.  They are scorers at 3 levels, they defend and they rebound.  The Celtics have always had a ball dominant PG since they have been on the team.  What I have been seeing as of late is an effort by them to share the ball with one another and to swing the ball to open teammates.  I do not expect them to do that at the level of a PG.  They are our two best offensive players.  I want them to shoot the ball and some players on this team need to shoot less.

In another post I mentioned that this is a bridge year.  Although Brad could potentially pull off some big time deal, I think the chances of that happening this season are slim.  The inconsistent play has been the result of a lot of factors.  The team is still being evaluated.   Once Ime figures out who fits best together we should realize an uptick in consistency.  

The Celtics have been to the playoffs 7 straight years.  Maybe they make it 8 straight or maybe they falter.  But I would not bet against them.

I think everyone may want to take a close look at the current great players in the NBA.

How long did it take them to get a ring?

dboss,

"Also I completely disagree with prakash as it relates to trading Jaylen Brown.  

Prakash you are laying the blame for what you refer to as flow and creativity on the Jays but you apparently think Jaylen is the one who should be traded.  You talk about fit but how can anyone know how a particular player will fit on this team or any team?

Flow and creativity should not be expected from either J.  That my friend is under the job description of a PG.  While I do think that the Jays need to continue to improve in moving the ball to teammates that cannot and will not be a primary function of either player.  They are scorers at 3 levels, they defend and they rebound.  The Celtics have always had a ball dominant PG since they have been on the team.  What I have been seeing as of late is an effort by them to share the ball with one another and to swing the ball to open teammates.  I do not expect them to do that at the level of a PG.  They are our two best offensive players.  I want them to shoot the ball and some players on this team need to shoot less."

I was just stating a gut feel in my post.  It will be great, as a fan, if you are right.  I hope it is as you say above.

Prakash

"I was just stating a gut feel in my post.  It will be great, as a fan, if you are right.  I hope it is as you say above."

Jaylen Brown is a more efficient scorer than Jayson.  But together they are a dynamic duo.

How can you really get better trading away one of those guys?  

I do not buy into the narrative that these two guys cannot play together or that they cannot make their team better.  

The fact is that the Celtics organization has not completed the task of building around those guys.  I think they are close but they still lack a real floor general and they need more length and athleticism on their frontline.

That's just my opinion.

Putting together another big 3 is one pathway to success but finding and acquiring that 3rd player is easier said than done.  I still believe that you can win with the Jays provided you are rock solid 3 through 10.

I think our #1 need is at PG.  We need the type of floor general that can score when needed  but can mostly push the pace and run the offense efficiently.  We do not have that player on the roster right now.

Even if you get that player on the roster, somebody will have to sacrifice. Lets do a what if. So you get Bradley Beal and put together the Big-3. Who will sacrifice their share? Who will be the Ray Allen or Chris Bosh?

I don’t see JB as that. That is just my opinion.

Now extrapolate. I don’t see JB as that on the current roster as well. Yes, he is a high quality player and we will better with him than without him. That is not the point. The point is that I am willing to exchange him for another high quality player.

What high level player would you trade Jaylen for Prakash?

cowens/oldschool wrote:What high level player would you trade Jaylen for Prakash?

I will trade JB for Bradley Beal, though not straight up. Perhaps JB+Josh Richardson for Bradley Beal + Spencer Dinwiddie (add salary match fodder like Hernangomez). Likely many will disagree with this but that is my thought.

prakash wrote:

cowens/oldschool wrote:What high level player would you trade Jaylen for Prakash?

I will trade JB for Bradley Beal, though not straight up.  Perhaps JB+Josh Richardson for Bradley Beal + Spencer Dinwiddie (add salary match fodder like Hernangomez).  Likely many will disagree with this but that is my thought.

What would he bring that would fit with this team better than Jaylen?

Jaylen is a lot bigger, younger and stronger

cowens/oldschool wrote:

prakash wrote:

cowens/oldschool wrote:What high level player would you trade Jaylen for Prakash?

I will trade JB for Bradley Beal, though not straight up.  Perhaps JB+Josh Richardson for Bradley Beal + Spencer Dinwiddie (add salary match fodder like Hernangomez).  Likely many will disagree with this but that is my thought.

What would he bring that would fit with this team better than Jaylen?

Jaylen is a lot bigger, younger and stronger

Beauty lies in the eyes of the beholder!

Yes, Jaylen is bigger and stronger, hence a better defender and rebounder. Beal is a better passer and better aware of the team and floor situation, has a much better assist to turnover ratio. As for younger, not much difference between 25 and 28. Beal is smoother and less reliant on physicality and has had less injury issues. JB and Beal are scoring about the same, 22.4 for JB and 23.3 for Beal but Beal does not have another star on the floor with him.

I just think that Beal will be a better fit.

Well I appreciate the physicality Jaylen brings, I actually enjoy seeing him go against the best at his position; the Lebrons, Durant, Kawhi, Siakim, when you see him hold his own against other elites, these are the types of pieces you need to combat the best. Beal is a completely different player and would be unfair to put him in those match ups. If I’m a GM I want that piece that can go against elite physical players, Beal can’t do that.

Prakash do you see if you exchange Beal for Jaylen, you would weaken our defense drastically and put too much pressure on Tatum to defend other elite MVP wing types, which could also take away from his energy on offense? I also think his statistics are a product of not playing with enough scoring talent, can be easy to put up big numbers on losing teams. Jaylen should also be given credit for being a key cog in taking his team deep in the playoffs as a young player, as opposed to Beal who no one knows how he will respond to playoff pressure/basketball.

dboss wrote:Some general observations.

The Celtics won a game that they were supposed to win.

Both team had a lot of players missing due to the health and safety protocols.

JB is starting to really cook after missing a lot of games with his hamstring injury.

JT is driving to the rim quite a bit.  He is also making noticeable attempts to pass the ball to open teammates.

The value of RW goes far beyond his vertical athleticism and 70% + makes.  Last night his screens freed up a lot of guys for wide open looks.  Rob is an excellent screener.  He does not get called for a lot of offensive fouls.  

While the Jays have ISO skills to get shots off the purity of using screens enhances their ability to score.  There was a sequence of plays where Rob screened for Tatum where he scored twice.  Then he did the same for Jaylen and then for Payton Pritchard.

Dennis Schroeder is in a funky place.  I know he had a sprained ankle a few games back but that has little to do with his overall play.  Right now he looks like a guy who only cares about his touches.  He is lackadaisical. His decision making is horrible.  Maybe Ime told him that he is being shopped.  One thing seems apparent.  

PP is finally getting some minutes.  The more minutes he gets the less minutes are there for Dennis and with JB back and Langford and Nesmith getting more playing time there is virtually no SG minutes for Dennis.  Plus we got Josh.  Dennis has been our 3rd leading scorer all year but his inefficiency does not really make us a better team.  Please move him and move on.

Also I completely disagree with prakash as it relates to trading Jaylen Brown.  

Prakash you are laying the blame for what you refer to as flow and creativity on the Jays but you apparently think Jaylen is the one who should be traded.  You talk about fit but how can anyone know how a particular player will fit on this team or any team?

Flow and creativity should not be expected from either J.  That my friend is under the job description of a PG.  While I do think that the Jays need to continue to improve in moving the ball to teammates that cannot and will not be a primary function of either player.  They are scorers at 3 levels, they defend and they rebound.  The Celtics have always had a ball dominant PG since they have been on the team.  What I have been seeing as of late is an effort by them to share the ball with one another and to swing the ball to open teammates.  I do not expect them to do that at the level of a PG.  They are our two best offensive players.  I want them to shoot the ball and some players on this team need to shoot less.

In another post I mentioned that this is a bridge year.  Although Brad could potentially pull off some big time deal, I think the chances of that happening this season are slim.  The inconsistent play has been the result of a lot of factors.  The team is still being evaluated.   Once Ime figures out who fits best together we should realize an uptick in consistency.  

The Celtics have been to the playoffs 7 straight years.  Maybe they make it 8 straight or maybe they falter.  But I would not bet against them.

I think everyone may want to take a close look at the current great players in the NBA.

How long did it take them to get a ring?

Yeah. How long? I hope like hell that we can win and keep both J’s. How long? Not long? (Thank you MLK).
Dboss, this is not the old NBA where players like Jordan, Bird, Magic etc  stick around forever on the same team forever.
Our window with the J’s is not as wide open as in the past NBA. They are entering their prime. How long? Not long.
We are and should be in the process of evaluating this team and that includes those 2 J’s. (And yes, we should be able to expect flow and creativity from both)
They’ve been the big dogs for the last 2-3 years (counting this year) and we haven’t seen anything close to championship type leadership or for that matter-winning and winning consistently.
As I said, I am wishing like hell that we can get a chip with these 2 but the side eye is in full effect.


Also, I’m not sure why you ask, “how can anyone know how a particular player will fit”
Dboss, you know as well as I do that teams have FO’s and scouts as well as coaches where part of their job is to know these things or come damn close. This isn’t and cannot be a guessing game. These players are not shoes that you try on and then decide. The investment is huge and prudence dictates that the brass get it right. It’s their job. None are perfect but if I’m Wyc and you’re Brad and you ask the question you just asked, I’m oiling up your skates.
How long? Not long. I’m still in love with the 2 J’s but there is an old saying that somewhat applies here (and please accept my apology if I offend anyone here) - Show me a beautiful woman and I’ll show you a guy thats tired of “%$#(* “ her! Insert side eye here.

Kitron while I heard that last line many moons ago, don’t know how it applies to basketball….also Steph Curry, Klay and Draymond are still there, as is Giannis and even KAT, not everyone ditches their franchise. I’m sure management wants to keep them, as long as they are happy here; they will stay as management keeps putting good better pieces around them. I actually still think we can get a jump forward form PP, Romeo and Nesmith still at some point.

cowens/oldschool wrote:Kitron while I heard that last line many moons ago, don’t know how it applies to basketball….also Steph Curry, Klay and Draymond are still there, as is Giannis and even KAT, not everyone ditches their franchise. I’m sure management wants to keep them, as long as they are happy here; they will stay as management keeps putting good better pieces around them. I actually still think we can get a jump forward form PP, Romeo and Nesmith still at some point.

Cowens, maybe so but at what point is my point. Steph, Klay and Draymond also have won 3 times and during their tenure that team continued to build and put the right pieces together. AND they’re doing it again now. Why leave if you’re winning (extracting KD while I write this)? Giannis-same. They made major moves and brought in Jrue and a few others and catapulted to a championship.
All I am intimating is that we need to get the right pieces (meaning proven not potential) around 2J and they’ll be no reason for them to kick rocks and go elsewhere. I don't think that those 2 and what we have around them ( I also like those other 3 you mentioned but not married to any of them..we’ll see)  is going to amount to very much. Either we bring in the right pieces or move one of them out.  I prefer to keep both. I’m just presenting alternatives.
The correlation with 2J and the beautiful woman/women is real but, well I’ll leave that alone. I don't want no trouble..:>)

cowens/oldschool wrote:Steph Curry, Klay and Draymond are still there, as is Giannis and even KAT, not everyone ditches their franchise. I’m sure management wants to keep them, as long as they are happy here; they will stay as management keeps putting good better pieces around them. I actually still think we can get a jump forward form PP, Romeo and Nesmith still at some point.

Right now Golden State only has Curry and Draymond. One is a lethal shooter and the other a savant ball/player mover and defender. The rest of the team just feeds off of them.

Also, these are the best two players and so others have to fit in.

dboss has been saying that we need to improve our creativity and ball movement and advocates a point guard. Well, to initiate and dominate ball movement, that point guard will have to dominate the ball. But for the Celts, the Js dominate the ball.

The Celts are still stuck at cross-roads. Play for now? Well, you don't have the roster for that. Play for future? Well, this is likely the last year for Al and we will again be left with a huge hole up front.

I don't find the prospect of #4-5 seed in EC exciting. Settling in for another season to be endured, unless Brad can finagle Simmons out of Philly.