Re: Official: Shaquile O'Neal a Boston Celtic Thread

[Brandon$$]

http://blogs.ajc.com/hawks/2010/08/05/atlanta-hawks-no-shaq-now-what/?cxntfid=blogs_hawks

With Shaq off to Boston here’s a quick epilogue as it relates to the Hawks:

I’ve been told that Atlanta wouldn’t budge on giving Shaq a starting nod over Al, who is after all still only 24-years old and an All-Star. Shaq believes he will get the starting nod over Jermaine O’Neal in Boston as Kendrick Perkins rehabs from his knee injury.

Atlanta also wasn’t willing to pay Shaq more than the minimum and that was a sticking point for him. He didn’t want to sign for the minimum when the Hawks had their bi-annual and mid-level exceptions available because of the perception that would create–as in the Hawks could have paid him more but didn’t. That’s not the case with Boston, which had neither of those exceptions and so could only give him the minimum.

The big guy still has his pride.

http://hoopshype.com/rumors.htm

Chris Forsberg: Might be reading too deep again, but found it interesting that Perkins declined to comment on the addition of Shaq.


http://articles.orlandosentinel.com/2010-08-05/sports/os-bianchi-column-0806-20100805_1_dried-up-little-pond-magic-uniform-stan-van-gundy/2


It's not just here; it's everywhere he's ever played. In L.A., he trashed Kobe, Phil Jackson and ownership on his way out of town. In Phoenix, Steve Nash couldn't stand playing with him. In Miami, he feuded with Pat Riley.

You think it's just coincidence that two of his former star teammates — LeBron and Dwyane Wade — didn't lobby to bring Shaq back to the Heat?

Now that he's in Boston, you just wonder how long it will take Shaq to say something disparaging about Bill Russell or irk coach Doc Rivers with his selfishness and laziness. Prediction: The Celtics may be happy Shaq is coming to town, but they will be even happier when he leaves town in two years.

"In his heyday, Shaq brought great results but he always left under great fire," Williams says. "The building is always engulfed in flames and burning down as he's going out the door."

The thing is with a little more class and a lot less ego, Shaq could have been bigger than Michael Jordan. He could have won six or seven rings in L.A and gone down as one of the most revered and respected players in the history of the game. With all his charm and charisma, he could have been one of the most admired and adored players who ever lived.

Instead, he is a basketball vagabond without a true home. When he retires, who will claim him as their own?

Probably the Lakers — if they must.

[worcester]

Sheed came to the Celts with a lot of baggage and that worked out ok. One fact overlooked in Shaq's acquisition is that teams will become more reluctant to lay hard fouls on Rondo and Paul as they did too often last year.

[MDCelticsFan]

Shaq's had a great career. He doesn't know when it's time to go home from the fair. First, he said 2010 would be his swan song. I don't know, maybe the divorce from Shawnee and child support is making him do this, or maybe he doesn't realize the show's over for him. The Celtics, regardless of how other posters spin this, are moving in the direction of the late 80's/early nineties grasping at washed up superstars like Dominique Wilkins, Artis Gilmore, and Xavier McDaniel. Injuries and fatigue, I fear will dog the coming year's squad even more than last year's squad. As far as Sheed was concerned, he had his moments, but was not able to give his utmost when the C's REALLY needed him due to his age and lack of commitment to physical conditioning.-MD!

[Sam]

MD,

You raise an interesting point. What's really in this for Shaq?

Does he need the $3-4 million over two years for child support payments? Is he a closet masochist who relishes the idea of subjecting himself to the old ordeal at age 38? Will this guy who has been into everything have nothing else to do with his time after he's retired? Is he in it for the adulation that will, of course, be automatic from a home crowd whose enemy he has been for so long? Is he addicted to the smells of resin and sweat? Or does he just like balls?

Maybe it's a little of each. But, if only to satisfy TJ, who believes I fabricate things just to appear positive about the Celtics, I might make this suggestion. Shaq could really be focused on refurbishing a career that has recently degenerated to pedestrian depths, by really putting out and trying to win another championship or two so as to leave the game on a high note?

He may care more about his needs than the Celtics' needs in the process. I don't care. He may be prone to rocking the chemistry boat. I don't believe that will last long on this team, for a host of reasons—not the least of which is that it could leak out and further deteriorate his image rather than to rebuild it.

I wouldn't presume to put myself in Doc's place, but I believe the best path to dealing with Shaq is to simplify priorities. One example could be telling him to rebound ferociously and let everything else take care of itself. That will offer him an ideal way to jump start his image by being a central figure in providing improvement where the team needs it...but without pressure to do everything. A corollary would be to tell him that bench minutes will help him play at his best at all times.

There will be several new members of this team, which will diffuse any chance that a strong new personality will dominate—especially with the Three Amigos and Rondo being the foundations of the evolving culture.

There are risks with any change, including this one. But, all things considered, I like the dimensions, inherent controls, and upside of this gamble.

Sam

[bobheckler]

Is Shaq better than Erden? IMO, yes.

Was Shaq better than Josh Boone, as a primary backup? IMO, yes.

Is Shaq better than Mbenga as a primary backup? IMO, yes.

Is Shaq better than just about every other big man available? IMO, yes.

Is Shaq therefore, at the veteran's minimum, the best pickup the Celtics could have made to fill a glaring need at the center position? IMO, yes.

bob

.

[tjmakz]

I saw Shaq last night at Busch Gardens in Tampa.
I didn't get a chance to talk to him because two City of Tampa police officers were around him.

I have always liked Shaq and in the Kobe/Shaq feud, I always favored Shaq but I did agree that it was time for Shaq to move on because it had become Kobe's team. I believe Shaq is a really good guy off the court. With Kobe, I am not so sure...

[worcester]

Bob, ditto your remarks on Shaq

[jeb]

tj

did you get close? How big is the guy up close?

jeb

[bobheckler]

tj

did you get close? How big is the guy up close?

jeb

jeb,

If he could breath fire he'd have a post-NBA career making B Japanese Sci-Fi movies.

bob

.

[jeb]

i was up next to scotty pippen and he was goliath giant

[tjmakz]

tj

did you get close? How big is the guy up close?

jeb

jeb,

Yes, we got close. As we got closer to him, we saw all heads in the crowd then you see the top of someone's back and his head above that.
He was mammoth not just because of his height but due to his overall size.
I am 6'3" and I felt puny compared to him.
This was similar to the time I met Manute Bol. With Manute it was just his height but with Shaq his height and build is very impressive.
Compared to other NBA players Shaq looks a little heavy, but in person he didn't at all.
He looked like a very large athlete.

[jeb]

What always made him so scary to me was his proportions which are not out of whack...he is just a big dude and moves like a smaller man. There in no awkward gangly stuff in his motion.

Good story. It's hard to get your head around how big these guys are. I did commercials with a lot of them and man they are seriously large dudes.

[dboss]

Having a debate about the merits of adding Shaq to this team is great stuff. Yes he has deficiencies with the pick and role defense but some of those deficiencies can be tempered when our PG's and wing players do a better job fighting over the top of picks.

Also new schemes can be developed to filter the opposing offense in a way that permits our PF's to become more active in rotating to the ball handler and permitting Shaq to control the defensive rebounding space.

In other words although Shaq does not have the lateral quickness to be a reliable P and R defender that is not a major issue the way i see it.

The upside is much greater and presents exciting possibilities. I think the big difference will be on the offensive side of the ball.

We have one of the best penetrating and passing PG's in the NBA. Too many times Perk has been the only option for Rondo and everytime Perk takes a shot I can honestly say I have no ides if he will make a shot. Shaq commands attention and when he is in the post he will be double teamed at times. This will definitely open up the offense for both Paul Pierce and Ray Allen. Bottom line, if they double up on our wings the Celtics are going to destroy teams inside with with a huge rotation of front line players. If the double in the paint it will open things up for our wings to score more easily.

If Shaq comes off the bench (and there is no telling how things will shake out) the second unit will finally have a anchor in the middle.

No matter who starts, Shaq will play significant minutes with the starters.

Some people are concerned about chemistry and how Shaq will fit into a different role. We all should keep in mind that the Celtics are a veteran team with many very strong personalities. And this team is held together by Doc Rivers. Shaq becomes just another piece to the puzzle. His role will be defined based on team needs. The process will take a while. The starters will need to come together with a new center in the middle and the rotation players will also need to figure out how to play together.

This will take some time since several of the rotation players will be new to the Celtics.

The final part of this project will be comnpleted when the starters and rotatioin players are seamlessly integrating together into a team where all the parts compliment one another.

Can't express how excited I am about watching this take place.

Go Celtics!

dboss

[Sam]

One factor that may help determine whether the pros outweigh the cons as far as Shaq is concerned will be how much lateral movement KG has regained. If he is laterally quicker than last year, he can fulfill that role on defense, leaving Shaq as a less mobile but effective last line of defense. If that comes true, I can see Shaq sometimes putting in some minutes with the starters.

However, I see his minutes being more consistent with bench demands. Moreover, to the extent that he plays with the starters, he'll have to learn to accommodate a system that's already in place (as he did in Cleveland). The bench consists mainly of relatively new players, and a new bench system will be largely adapted to their respective skills, giving Shaq less to adjust to and greater ability to leverage his strengths.

Sam

[bobheckler]

Doc has shown, over the years, to be a "matchup" coach, versus a "system" coach. Unless he completely changes his spots, I expect Shaq to play with whatever team he can best take advantage of matchups with.

For example, against Orlando and D12, I expect he'd start (or come in the game early) and JO will play against the more mobile but less physical Gortat. Against Chicago and the more nimble Noah, I expect he'd come off the bench.

bob

.

[dboss]

Sam

Your point about KG is right on point. I expect to see great improvement in his lateral quickness.

As far as who starts at center and who would be a better fit for the staters, that is still a ? mark in my mind.

The Celtics would have more flexibility with JON coming off the bench.

Also since both Shaq and JON have expereinced injury problems, at some point during the season we will see both of them in the starting lineup. There are many veterans on nthe team and I am comvinced that they will figure out a way to play together regardless of who is on the floor.

dboss

[Sam]

Bob, good point about matchups. It seems to me that Doc has habitually stayed with one starting lineup against all comers (pending injuries, of course). Maybe he'll deviate from that practice in a case like Sheed's. But I believe Doc is extremely sensitive to continuity and would not keep changing the starting lineup just because of matchups. I think your idea about Shaq's coming in early against someone like Howard is more realistic.

It's going to be fascinating; that's for sure!

Sam

[sinus007]

Hi,
I'm excited to see how Shaq will fit into the team. Can't wait. I'm ready to ask the proverbial question: "are we there yet". Is Oct. 26 the day after tomorrow?
Regarding who'll start, who comes from the bench. Last year there was a "link" that tied the starters with the 2nd unit which mostly was served by RA. I wonder if the same gonna happen this year and who will do it? My concern is about RA's minutes. Sorry - it's OT.

AK

[Sam]

That's a good question, Sinus. One possibility is that Doc may choose to have a steadying influence in there with four bench players while the bench players become familiar with one another; and then go with five bench players once they're reasonably well gelled so the starters get more rest as the season progresses. The starter who initially does double duty might possibly be Rondo.

It's fun conjecturing already. Just think ahead to where we're actually watching games

Sam

[Brandon$$]

Ray Allen likes Shaquille O'Neal signing
http://sports.espn.go.com/boston/nba/news/story?id=5445641



Ray Allen says there is room in Boston for the Big Diesel and the Big Three.

The Celtics guard, speaking Saturday before a charity basketball game in Connecticut, said he believes Shaquille O'Neal is a good fit in Boston's quest to repeat as Eastern Conference champion.

The 7-foot-1, 325-pound center signed a two-year contract worth about $3 million on Wednesday.

"It's definitely interesting to me, because I think he can help us," Allen said. "One of our bad traits this past year was offensive rebounding and rebounding in general, and he's a guy that takes up a lot of space, so I definitely think he can help us."

Allen said he wasn't sure he would be returning to Boston after the NBA Finals. A good friend, he said, was even sending him advertisements of houses for sale in Miami.

"I don't think anybody's mind had to be changed," he said. "I think once the dust settled, we all had to understand what our stance was. Everybody took a look and said, 'We still have something good here, and we don't want to give it away."

Allen said he's looking forward to the battles with LeBron James and Miami, and likes being in the underdog role, rather than the team with the bull's-eye on its back.

"It was hard in '08 when everyone gave us the trophy every corner that we turned," he said.

[bigpygme]

Certainly i'm glad Ray likes it. today's paper says R Parish likes the move too.
so do i. i believe there will be negatives, and probably some important ones (FT and P&R D), but also believe the positive impact will outweigh the negative factors.
agree that Doc's coaching will be key to making both units maximally effective, and though i don't like all he d oes or everything about the way he does it, i am really REALLY glad he's on board to manage all this.

Michael

[worcester]

It's hard to imagine anyone else coaching THIS team.

[bobheckler]

It's hard to imagine anyone else coaching THIS team.

worcester,

The flip side of that is "it's hard to imagine Eric Spoelstra coaching HIS team". I don't think he's got the backbone, credibility or experience to do it and if I'm right about this we're going to be treated to a Bonfire of the Vanities this year as the stars try to coach each other and themselves.

bob

.

[worcester]

Bob, I think you're exactly right, which is why Pat Reilly will probably have a greater hand in day to day matters with the Heat. On another note, with Harry Truman's quote in mind - "If you can't take the heat, get out of the kitchen" - maybe we should start calling this year's Celtics team the Top Chefs.

[bigpygme]

this today from Globe's Tony Mazz ... there's a lot of "if's", but then he says this ...
"maybe – just maybe – Shaq’s presence in the offense would free up Kevin Garnett a little more on the offensive end, allowing Garnett to play from the high post, facing the basket, instead of on the block with his back to the hoop. Garnett then would become a great mismatch in the Celtics’ favor, all while being able to better exploit his sensational passing ability."

freeing KG up top to pass or shoot ... well well well, wouldn't that be something to dance about !

i sure hope the general optimism on this board is well placed and we've got something here. if he shows up in better shape than sheed was in most of last year, Shaq could really bring something to the party.

Michael

[Sponsored content]