Celtic Roster

cowens/oldschool wrote:

bobheckler wrote:Jay King @ByJayKing
about 1 hour ago
Brad Stevens said there’s no doubt Aaron Nesmith will get opportunities. Said Nesmith’s work ethic is excellent, he’s in the gym first every day, and he’s made great strides already even though he’s not getting minutes.


Bob
MY NOTE:  "Made great strides"?  Sounds to me like he was underwhelming from the get-go and is now, finally, showing Brad something.


.

We need another decent/good wing so bad, already the 2 J’s the franchise are fatigued like I’ve never seen them before. When one sits we have problems, heck even with both on floor together last few games they have been underwhelming. So we need someone to step up when a J needs a breather, not solving this dilemma is going to make or break the season. The light bulb has went on for Saddiq Bey, he had a another productive game tonight in a win after scorching us the previous game, but he was allowed to develop in real time in real games. If Brad really believes in Nesmith, play him now every game.

Cow,

The Js have spaghetti legs.  Bey is averaging about 20mpg on a shitty team.  His fg% is 42%.  He's averaging 3.5rpg with 20mpg.  That's not that great for a 6'7" player, is it?  He's only averaging 9.1ppg.  His previous career high in points was 20 points vs Milwaukee on 1/6/21.  He scored in double digits, 10 points or more, in 13 of the 25 games he has played in so far.  Imagine if a Celtic only hit 10+ in half his games, would we be talking about "the light bulb coming on" or would we be rolling our eyes and saying "I hope we don't have another Jeff Green!"?  I don't think we should read too much into his game vs us, it's just one game.  It does seem that he gets up for big games though.

Saddiq Bey's performance against us does not have anything to do with our issues.  Our issues were rearing their ugly heads over the previous weeks before the Detroit game.  It started when Marcus Smart went down, because without Smart our floor generalship is very, very (very?) thin.  Kemba is a two in a one's body.  The J's have tried to step up but that's a new part of their games and they're doing the best they can but they are creating a lot more turnovers because the ball is in their hands a lot more.  It is also more mentally fatiguing for them.  What we're seeing here, in my opinion, is the true value of what Gordon Hayward was to this team.  It didn't matter if Smart was out, or that Kemba's not a true point guard nor that the Js were mediocre playmakers.  We had Gordon.  We don't anymore and that is abundantly obvious, but hardly surprising.  We all knew, and explicitly acknowledged when the season started and the roster was what the roster was, that we were thin at floor general and that was despite the belief that Jeff Teague wasn't washed up.  We still knew we were thin there and, with Teague's career imploding before our very eyes and Smart out, we fell off the cliff. Think about how desperate we are that we're hanging our hopes on a #26 pick 23 year old rookie.

Danny's looking for scoring with size.  Well I'm good with that, but we need another floor general perhaps even more.  Trade Teague for Rondo, if you can.  I think if we can get Rondo, or someone with his type of talents, we'll see a big difference in our offense and a rejuvenation of the Js.  A game or two off for them and a Rondo is what we need.  Harrison Barnes will let them get those games off, and a Vucevic would give us the shooting with size, but it won't fix our offense having become a bunch of ME-ballers.


Bob


.

bobheckler wrote:

cowens/oldschool wrote:

bobheckler wrote:Jay King @ByJayKing
about 1 hour ago
Brad Stevens said there’s no doubt Aaron Nesmith will get opportunities. Said Nesmith’s work ethic is excellent, he’s in the gym first every day, and he’s made great strides already even though he’s not getting minutes.


Bob
MY NOTE:  "Made great strides"?  Sounds to me like he was underwhelming from the get-go and is now, finally, showing Brad something.


.

We need another decent/good wing so bad, already the 2 J’s the franchise are fatigued like I’ve never seen them before. When one sits we have problems, heck even with both on floor together last few games they have been underwhelming. So we need someone to step up when a J needs a breather, not solving this dilemma is going to make or break the season. The light bulb has went on for Saddiq Bey, he had a another productive game tonight in a win after scorching us the previous game, but he was allowed to develop in real time in real games. If Brad really believes in Nesmith, play him now every game.

Cow,

The Js have spaghetti legs.  Bey is averaging about 20mpg on a shitty team.  His fg% is 42%.  He's averaging 3.5rpg with 20mpg.  That's not that great for a 6'7" player, is it?  He's only averaging 9.1ppg.  His previous career high in points was 20 points vs Milwaukee on 1/6/21.  He scored in double digits, 10 points or more, in 13 of the 25 games he has played in so far.  Imagine if a Celtic only hit 10+ in half his games, would we be talking about "the light bulb coming on" or would we be rolling our eyes and saying "I hope we don't have another Jeff Green!"?  I don't think we should read too much into his game vs us, it's just one game.  It does seem that he gets up for big games though.

Saddiq Bey's performance against us does not have anything to do with our issues.  Our issues were rearing their ugly heads over the previous weeks before the Detroit game.  It started when Marcus Smart went down, because without Smart our floor generalship is very, very (very?) thin.  Kemba is a two in a one's body.  The J's have tried to step up but that's a new part of their games and they're doing the best they can but they are creating a lot more turnovers because the ball is in their hands a lot more.  It is also more mentally fatiguing for them.  What we're seeing here, in my opinion, is the true value of what Gordon Hayward was to this team.  It didn't matter if Smart was out, or that Kemba's not a true point guard nor that the Js were mediocre playmakers.  We had Gordon.  We don't anymore and that is abundantly obvious, but hardly surprising.  We all knew, and explicitly acknowledged when the season started and the roster was what the roster was, that we were thin at floor general and that was despite the belief that Jeff Teague wasn't washed up.  We still knew we were thin there and, with Teague's career imploding before our very eyes and Smart out, we fell off the cliff.  Think about how desperate we are that we're hanging our hopes on a #26 pick 23 year old rookie.

Danny's looking for scoring with size.  Well I'm good with that, but we need another floor general perhaps even more.  Trade Teague for Rondo, if you can.  I think if we can get Rondo, or someone with his type of talents, we'll see a big difference in our offense and a rejuvenation of the Js.  A game or two off for them and a Rondo is what we need.  Harrison Barnes will let them get those games off, and a Vucevic would give us the shooting with size, but it won't fix our offense having become a bunch of ME-ballers.


Bob


.

Interesting comment on Rondo.

I don't think we can get Barnes or Vucevic, but I believe Rondo could possibly provide the exact shot of ball movement and attitude this team could use right now. Rondo would be the setup man the two J's could use. I have no idea if he could be moved, but he would be a worthwhile rental and I would like to see that one happen.

NYCelt wrote:

bobheckler wrote:

cowens/oldschool wrote:

bobheckler wrote:Jay King @ByJayKing
about 1 hour ago
Brad Stevens said there’s no doubt Aaron Nesmith will get opportunities. Said Nesmith’s work ethic is excellent, he’s in the gym first every day, and he’s made great strides already even though he’s not getting minutes.


Bob
MY NOTE:  "Made great strides"?  Sounds to me like he was underwhelming from the get-go and is now, finally, showing Brad something.


.

We need another decent/good wing so bad, already the 2 J’s the franchise are fatigued like I’ve never seen them before. When one sits we have problems, heck even with both on floor together last few games they have been underwhelming. So we need someone to step up when a J needs a breather, not solving this dilemma is going to make or break the season. The light bulb has went on for Saddiq Bey, he had a another productive game tonight in a win after scorching us the previous game, but he was allowed to develop in real time in real games. If Brad really believes in Nesmith, play him now every game.

Cow,

The Js have spaghetti legs.  Bey is averaging about 20mpg on a shitty team.  His fg% is 42%.  He's averaging 3.5rpg with 20mpg.  That's not that great for a 6'7" player, is it?  He's only averaging 9.1ppg.  His previous career high in points was 20 points vs Milwaukee on 1/6/21.  He scored in double digits, 10 points or more, in 13 of the 25 games he has played in so far.  Imagine if a Celtic only hit 10+ in half his games, would we be talking about "the light bulb coming on" or would we be rolling our eyes and saying "I hope we don't have another Jeff Green!"?  I don't think we should read too much into his game vs us, it's just one game.  It does seem that he gets up for big games though.

Saddiq Bey's performance against us does not have anything to do with our issues.  Our issues were rearing their ugly heads over the previous weeks before the Detroit game.  It started when Marcus Smart went down, because without Smart our floor generalship is very, very (very?) thin.  Kemba is a two in a one's body.  The J's have tried to step up but that's a new part of their games and they're doing the best they can but they are creating a lot more turnovers because the ball is in their hands a lot more.  It is also more mentally fatiguing for them.  What we're seeing here, in my opinion, is the true value of what Gordon Hayward was to this team.  It didn't matter if Smart was out, or that Kemba's not a true point guard nor that the Js were mediocre playmakers.  We had Gordon.  We don't anymore and that is abundantly obvious, but hardly surprising.  We all knew, and explicitly acknowledged when the season started and the roster was what the roster was, that we were thin at floor general and that was despite the belief that Jeff Teague wasn't washed up.  We still knew we were thin there and, with Teague's career imploding before our very eyes and Smart out, we fell off the cliff.  Think about how desperate we are that we're hanging our hopes on a #26 pick 23 year old rookie.

Danny's looking for scoring with size.  Well I'm good with that, but we need another floor general perhaps even more.  Trade Teague for Rondo, if you can.  I think if we can get Rondo, or someone with his type of talents, we'll see a big difference in our offense and a rejuvenation of the Js.  A game or two off for them and a Rondo is what we need.  Harrison Barnes will let them get those games off, and a Vucevic would give us the shooting with size, but it won't fix our offense having become a bunch of ME-ballers.


Bob


.

Interesting comment on Rondo.

I don't think we can get Barnes or Vucevic, but I believe Rondo could possibly provide the exact shot of ball movement and attitude this team could use right now. Rondo would be the setup man the two J's could use. I have no idea if he could be moved, but he would be a worthwhile rental and I would like to see that one happen.

I second that emotion
-Smokey and the Miracles

I am more surprised at Tatum than I am Jaylen. It looks to me that those weeks he had off for covid were rough on him. He has had spots of brightness but, it looks like it took alot of his energy away from him. God bless Jaylen, even though he knew he had a lousy game, he still came up with 25 points, He is working hard with no legs under him. I think we really need to spot Jason a little more I just do not know who will pick up the scoring when he is gone.

It is obvious to me that Green is probably fighting for his life right now but has not done much to convince them the could be the answer.

John Karalis @RedsArmy_John
about 33 minutes ago
Celtics face a 5PM deadline on whether to guarantee Javonte Green's $1.5 million salary. They could keep him to give him more chances, cut him to save some cash, or they could keep him as a potential salary to aggregate in a trade. I'm betting the latter


Bob
MY NOTE:  If the Celts cut Javonte loose then you know, for sure, a trade or free agent signing is coming because Danny is opening up a roster spot.  Javonte doesn't make so much money they can't afford him.  He's either on the team or he's a cheap, expiring contract in a deal.  So, if his contract is guaranteed that doesn't necessarily mean he won't be traded, Danny might use his contract (which is only $1.5M this year and has a $1.87M qualifying offer next year) for filler.  Green's cheap and, if you like him, he can be kept for cheap next year since I don't see anybody blowing away that $1.87M QO.  That might an appealing sales pitch to a GM who's looking to cut salary, yet interested in picking up a veteran.


.

He has played in spots, but not enough to say "we can't get rid of him". It is too bad, he just is taking the spot for a new player to come in an contribute immediately

Can we dump JeT also or instead.

worcester wrote:Can we dump JeT also or instead.

worcester,

Teague's $2.567M contract is guaranteed for this year.  We'd have to eat his contract to clear his roster spot, or trade him.  The good news is that we can use one of our two smaller TPE to facilitate a trade.

The $2.51M for the Poirier-to-OKC trade cannot be used because JeT makes >$2.51M.  However, the $4.767M TPE from the Kanter-to-Portland trade can be used.

We could trade JeT to whomever and give them part of the Kanter TPE so they can cut JeT right away and receive cash from the Celtics to pay for him.  If they choose to keep JeT (although God alone knows why they would) then they get to keep the $2.567M salary relief. It's a no-lose for them, it frees up a roster spot for us since we don't need to take a player back (I'm pretty sure of this but, when in doubt, HELP GYSO!!!).


Bob


.

At the risk of sounding redundant which I’m going to do because as Snoop Dogg would say, “I can’t belieevvvve this shit.”

Danny actually thought that #55 was an upgrade over Wanny. Let that set in for a second or two.

“I can’t believvvvve this shit”!!

Danny is apparently in cognitive decline. Time for him to call Snoop for some enhancements.

Bob,

When a TPE is used, it ALWAYS brings back a player, at least that is how I understand it.  It cannot be used just to eliminate (or transfer) salary, as you propose.

So you want to dump JeT and use the middle TPE to improve our roster?  I'm onboard, but lets go through an example of using JeT's contract, the middle TPE, cash and a protected second round pick.

Nothing holding a $$ value can be added to a TPE on the way out the door in a single transaction.  In order to supply the incentive for the other team to do the trade, you split up the transaction (at least from our perspective) into two transactions:

1)  TPE ($4.767M) + protected second rounder traded for [Player X]

2)  JeT ($2.564M) + Cash (< $2.203M) traded for a brand new (yet smaller) $2.564M TPE.

Rules of the trade:

A) Player X is the targeted player.  His salary must be less than the TPE, while being as close as possible to the TPE.  This is so the Cash amount can be maximized.  This player should have a salary in the range of $4.5M, +/- $200k.

B) The math (from the other team's perspective: a single trade) is:  

Salary out: Player X's salary (< $4.767M) = Salary in: JeT ($2.564M) + Cash allowed ($2.203M or less).  

As Player X's salary decreases, the cash amount also decreases.

We are looking for a very specific salary range in this example.

The lesson here is that when using a TPE, you target a player and the transaction is split up into two.  The first one includes the TPE and a draft pick (incentive).  The second one includes other players, cash, etc. (aka: more incentive).

bobheckler wrote:John Karalis @RedsArmy_John
about 33 minutes ago
Celtics face a 5PM deadline on whether to guarantee Javonte Green's $1.5 million salary. They could keep him to give him more chances, cut him to save some cash, or they could keep him as a potential salary to aggregate in a trade. I'm betting the latter


Bob
MY NOTE:  If the Celts cut Javonte loose then you know, for sure, a trade or free agent signing is coming because Danny is opening up a roster spot.  Javonte doesn't make so much money they can't afford him.  He's either on the team or he's a cheap, expiring contract in a deal.  So, if his contract is guaranteed that doesn't necessarily mean he won't be traded, Danny might use his contract (which is only $1.5M this year and has a $1.87M qualifying offer next year) for filler.  Green's cheap and, if you like him, he can be kept for cheap next year since I don't see anybody blowing away that $1.87M QO.  That might an appealing sales pitch to a GM who's looking to cut salary, yet interested in picking up a veteran.


.

Gary Washburn @GwashburnGlobe
about 43 minutes ago
Since Javonte Green is on the State Farm Arena floor shooting jumpers, I'm going to assume the #Celtics have guaranteed his contract.



Bob


.

bobheckler wrote:

bobheckler wrote:John Karalis @RedsArmy_John
about 33 minutes ago
Celtics face a 5PM deadline on whether to guarantee Javonte Green's $1.5 million salary. They could keep him to give him more chances, cut him to save some cash, or they could keep him as a potential salary to aggregate in a trade. I'm betting the latter


Bob
MY NOTE:  If the Celts cut Javonte loose then you know, for sure, a trade or free agent signing is coming because Danny is opening up a roster spot.  Javonte doesn't make so much money they can't afford him.  He's either on the team or he's a cheap, expiring contract in a deal.  So, if his contract is guaranteed that doesn't necessarily mean he won't be traded, Danny might use his contract (which is only $1.5M this year and has a $1.87M qualifying offer next year) for filler.  Green's cheap and, if you like him, he can be kept for cheap next year since I don't see anybody blowing away that $1.87M QO.  That might an appealing sales pitch to a GM who's looking to cut salary, yet interested in picking up a veteran.


.

Gary Washburn @GwashburnGlobe
about 43 minutes ago
Since Javonte Green is on the State Farm Arena floor shooting jumpers, I'm going to assume the #Celtics have guaranteed his contract.



Bob

.

I am sorry to bring this constantly up but this is yet another sign for me that Danny does not WANT to make a trade or somehow is NOT ABLE to.

I will refer once again to the Harden trade where Cleveland got:
- Starting Level Center in Jarret Allen (young too)
- Wing backup in Tauren Prince

For the price of:
- Dante Exum
- 2022 first round draft pick(via Milwaukee)
- 2024 second round draft pick

2 out of our 3 support roles we need are already there:
- Good quality Center that unlike RWill can PLAY A WHOLE GAME
- Good quality 3 and D back up Wing

The only thing left would have been to find a good back up PG that can act as a leader as well (I like Rondo a lot for this btw)

Or we are thinking Danny did not know or could not jump into that deal? Or could not offer better deal than a back up guard + change?

Do not think for one minute Danny is stupid. Whatever is explored here or anywhere, does not mean it can be done or should be done. Continually calling him out as incompetent is ridiculous. Just listen to Wyc....he is making no change at the top or coaching.

Someone should put the interview with Mike Gorman on 98.5 Sports and listen to his opinion on all of this. It is more the way I have felt for a while.

I have been on the opposite site of most on here, I have felt from the beginning that it is not Brad, it is the players. Just the way I have felt from the start.

RosalieTCeltics wrote:Do not think for one minute Danny is stupid.  Whatever is explored here or anywhere, does not mean it can be done or should be done. Continually calling him out as incompetent is ridiculous. Just listen to Wyc....he is making no change at the top or coaching.  

Someone should put the interview with Mike Gorman on 98.5 Sports and listen to his opinion on all of this. It is more the way I have felt for a while.

I have been on the opposite site of most on here, I have felt from the beginning that it is not Brad, it is the players.  Just the way I have felt from the start.

+Infinity Squared Plus One

Chris Forsberg @ChrisForsberg_
about 4 hours ago
Danny Ainge on @Toucherandrich said team should be close to 100 percent after All-Star break (which suggests Romeo is close to return). After chatter about his future, Ainge also noted he has no plans in mind for when he’ll move on from GM post. Said he’ll know when it’s time.


Bob
MY NOTE:  So, for all you Danny-haters out there (you know who you are), it doesn't look like he's going anywhere in the near future.


.

FINE WITH ME, SAME WITH BRAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

RosalieTCeltics wrote:FINE WITH ME, SAME WITH BRAD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I like the way you think Rosalie!

I admit it out here I am the Danny Ainge and Brad Stevens hater.  

Not really because strong criticism is not the same as hate.  

Do I think it is time for Danny to move on?  It is a good question I think and it is also a good question to ponder if Brad Stevens can take this team or any team to a championship and win.  The same could be said for any coach who has never won a title.  

Danny has been very successful at the helm of the Celtics  but he has also made a lot of bone head decisions that are adding up on the wrong column the longer he remains in place.  Danny has not achieved his stated goal of building a championship level ball club in 5 years.  

These guys are not Supreme Court Judges.  There is no tenure here.  So how many more years are you willing to wait?   What has to happen before anyone out there believes that it is time for a change.  We are already 13 years removed from our 2008 title.  So how many more years are you willing to wait to get banner #18?  5 more, 10 more, 15 more?  Maybe if I was never a Celtics fan and never experienced seeing my team win, all that has happened would seem quite normal.  

I may be wrong but I think they should be gone.

As being in the wagon with dboss I want to add:

I am disappointed with Brad Stevens. He is a great coach who apparently lacks some very important skills to be successful with a winning team in the NBA. This is not why I am disappointed - I just expected he would have learned those on the job by now. He has gone deep in the playoffs enough times already...
I do NOT believe we can get a better coach than Stevens at this time though. I wish he would recognize his deficiencies and get some help hired to HELP him. I was completely serious when suggesting KG as assistant coach. Or one of the grizzled veterans like Thibs would work imo.

Much more disappointed in Danny Ainge. He has made some very good decisions in the last 5 years. But he is ultimately the one responsible for lacking depth, picking the wrong free agents, current complete lack of back up for our stars and diminishing assets without a return. So yeah, I actually do think that after (and still IF) this season crashes and burns it would be time for Danny to step aside and let someone else have at it.
I know it is not a popular opinion, but it is mine nonetheless.

Maccabi Tel Aviv is the Boston Celtics of the Euro League, no team has won more Championships than them.  They are currently 14-3 this season and in 1st place in the Israeli Premier League, but not doing so well in the Euro League.  Yam Madar's team, Hapoel Tel Aviv, is in 11th place at 3-14.  So what we have here is a good team up against a bad team.  I don't know how much can be read into this, Maccabi isn't doing so well in the better Euro League and Hapoel is doing poorly in the weaker league.  Madar looks pretty good, has Pritchard level ball handling skills and shoots well but, once again, what about the level of competition.




Bob


.

Bob


.

Bob
MY NOTE:  The kid works hard and earns his share of  Tommy Points.  A good rebounder for his size.  As Brad says in this video the game is slowing down for Nesmith.  When it does, and all those thousands of hours of muscle memory shooting jumpers kick in, watch out!




.

As I have said a few times, I would love for the kid to go off and have a great shooting night. Would do a lot for his confidence. Look at Pritchard, the kid is not afraid. Even with his time shortened a little, he still comes in and tries like heck out there. I have noticed a hesitancy in his shooting at times, but that will go away. Smart is encouraging him to take the shot when it is there. So if this could happen with Nesmith, it would be awesome. Time will tell. Of course, the return of Fournier willl take some minutes away also.