Let the Speculations begin

tjmakz wrote:bob,

I would be happy with LA getting Delonte West and Jason Kapono...
Trading for Howard or Paul is a long shot and I don't see them trading for both players.
Why would New Orleans want Pau? Pau is an excellent player that can put a championship caliber team over the top but he is not one to build your team around. And he is 31 years old. If anything Pau would go to another team and they would trade someone to New Orleans.

Yes, there are tons of rumors out there. It should be very interesting starting Friday when free agents can sign.


Boston should take a look at Fesenko. He is a big dude that plays physical and has a chip on his shoulder. Not much offense, but he hasn't really been given the chance.

TJ,

I agree about Fesenko. I think I opined somewhere about how I thought he did a good job of standing in for Okur during his injury.

It's been a while since we've had an offensively-proficient center (I do not consider Krstic to be "offensively-proficient", although he doesn't have stone-hands either). Cowens might be the last. Must be nice.

Both of those teams, Orlando and NO, are looking at what's the best deal they can get for D12 and CP3. Maybe they're looking at it being a two-step process (e.g. Gasol to NO and then traded at some future date for other players).

We'll see. I'll tell you one thing, if the whole idea behind the CBA was to create parity between the Haves and the Have Nots, then LAL picking up both Howard and Paul in the very first season after the new CBA is in place would make that seem like a joke, wouldn't it?

bob

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Bob,
In Re Shane Battier. My understanding is that he's 3. Wouldn't he be redundant with JG? I'm not sure JG, if signed, can be 4 other than in a pinch.

Agree with your #5.

As I mentioned before, I'd take a chance with MD. Same for LP: if his knees hold - he's a very valuable asset at 4. This brings me to BBD: I'm still on the fense, can't decide to D (avis) or not to B(ig)B(aby).

Would be really disappointed if DW goes to LA.

AK

TJ, the rumor I heard was Odum and Bynum to NO and Gasol to ORL. There were other players involved but that was the meat of it. If I'm NO I would do that and then make a play for either Aaron Brooks or attempt to get Darren Collison back from Indiana. They are going to lose CP3 anyway and won't come away with a better haul than the 2 Laker bigs, especially if they can get a quality point guard and/or re-sign David West. Of course it would also reunite Trevor Ariza with his old frontcourt running mates. On the other hand, ORL can do much better than Gasol if and when they decide to trade Howard.

sinus007 wrote:Bob,
In Re Shane Battier. My understanding is that he's 3. Wouldn't he be redundant with JG? I'm not sure JG, if signed, can be 4 other than in a pinch.

Agree with your #5.

As I mentioned before, I'd take a chance with MD. Same for LP: if his knees hold - he's a very valuable asset at 4. This brings me to BBD: I'm still on the fense, can't decide to D (avis) or not to B(ig)B(aby).

Would be really disappointed if DW goes to LA.

AK

sinus,

To "D" or not to "B"? That is the my confession.
Whether it is nobler, in my mind, to suffer
the swings and horrors of outrageous players;
or to take arms against a "C" of troubles
and by opposing end them.

Yes, I wouldn't be happy if DW goes to Hollywood, but ya neva know.

The whole idea of "no contracts until the start of camp" has turned into a complete fiasco. Everybody's waiting on everybody else to establish the market. They're all waiting for the first shoe to drop.

bob

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bobheckler wrote:

sinus007 wrote:Bob,
In Re Shane Battier. My understanding is that he's 3. Wouldn't he be redundant with JG? I'm not sure JG, if signed, can be 4 other than in a pinch.

Agree with your #5.

As I mentioned before, I'd take a chance with MD. Same for LP: if his knees hold - he's a very valuable asset at 4. This brings me to BBD: I'm still on the fense, can't decide to D (avis) or not to B(ig)B(aby).

Would be really disappointed if DW goes to LA.

AK

sinus,

To "D" or not to "B"? That is the my confession.
Whether it is nobler, in my mind, to suffer
the swings and horrors of outrageous players;
or to take arms against a "C" of troubles
and by opposing end them.

Yes, I wouldn't be happy if DW goes to Hollywood, but ya neva know.

The whole idea of "no contracts until the start of camp" has turned into a complete fiasco. Everybody's waiting on everybody else to establish the market. They're all waiting for the first shoe to drop.

bob

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As our buddy Jeb might say " A hungry dog hunts best" Wonder if Ainge is hungry?

beat

I, too, was under the assumption that the new CBA would stop all of this stock piling by the top teams and the lower ones scrape along. I would not be shocked at all to see Howard end up in LA, he is dying for the bright lights of Hollywood. He already acts like a movie star! As far as Paul is concerned, why wouldn't he go there if he could play with Kobe? Why he wouldn't want to
play with PP, KG, and Ray is beyond me. The decision is all money oriented, and there is more chance of making "outside" money in LA.

Please, please, stop the rumors of Kwame Brown being considered. I just don't see that as a smart decision, all he is is a body. I'll take my chances
with Leon before that guy.

The fact that Ainge contacted Baby's agent right away doesn't mean much except that maybe he would consider a sign and trade, why lose him for nothing?

The rumor mill is crazy, what is true and what is false is a big question.
Let's just basketball!!!

bobheckler wrote:

tjmakz wrote:bob,

I would be happy with LA getting Delonte West and Jason Kapono...
Trading for Howard or Paul is a long shot and I don't see them trading for both players.
Why would New Orleans want Pau? Pau is an excellent player that can put a championship caliber team over the top but he is not one to build your team around. And he is 31 years old. If anything Pau would go to another team and they would trade someone to New Orleans.

Yes, there are tons of rumors out there. It should be very interesting starting Friday when free agents can sign.


Boston should take a look at Fesenko. He is a big dude that plays physical and has a chip on his shoulder. Not much offense, but he hasn't really been given the chance.

TJ,

I agree about Fesenko. I think I opined somewhere about how I thought he did a good job of standing in for Okur during his injury.

It's been a while since we've had an offensively-proficient center (I do not consider Krstic to be "offensively-proficient", although he doesn't have stone-hands either). Cowens might be the last. Must be nice.

Both of those teams, Orlando and NO, are looking at what's the best deal they can get for D12 and CP3. Maybe they're looking at it being a two-step process (e.g. Gasol to NO and then traded at some future date for other players).

We'll see. I'll tell you one thing, if the whole idea behind the CBA was to create parity between the Haves and the Have Nots, then LAL picking up both Howard and Paul in the very first season after the new CBA is in place would make that seem like a joke, wouldn't it?

bob

.

bob,

Parity in the new CBA will mean large amount of luxury $$$ being sent from the Lakers (and some other teams) to the lower payroll teams.
Years 3-4 and forward will mean huge amounts of money that LA might have to fork over...
Parity as far as balanced teams was barely addressed.
It is more the 'fault' of the players who want to play in specific cities for specific teams.
The league did not address this because they do not want the large market teams to be too hurt by regulations.
The league does not prosper when the large market teams are not successful.

willjr wrote:TJ, the rumor I heard was Odum and Bynum to NO and Gasol to ORL. There were other players involved but that was the meat of it. If I'm NO I would do that and then make a play for either Aaron Brooks or attempt to get Darren Collison back from Indiana. They are going to lose CP3 anyway and won't come away with a better haul than the 2 Laker bigs, especially if they can get a quality point guard and/or re-sign David West. Of course it would also reunite Trevor Ariza with his old frontcourt running mates. On the other hand, ORL can do much better than Gasol if and when they decide to trade Howard.

willjr,

I think LA would trade Bynum and Odom for Paul.
Orlando would not trade Howard for Gasol.
Maybe if LA added Walton, that would sway Orlando.
Neither should they trade Howard for a package with Brook Lopez who is a 6'4" guy in a 7 footers body.

If LA had an idea that they could get Baron Davis if he was an amnesty casualty, I think LA would hold off on the Chris Paul trade.
But, LA's more pressing need is a pg.
They are fine if they trade Bynum or Gasol and trade for Paul.

Personally, I don't think Paul will be a Laker.
Since New Orleans is owned by the NBA, they have to be real careful that they get top dollar for Chris Paul.

Is there any way for Paul to end up in Orlando with Howard?

swedeinestonia wrote:Is there any way for Paul to end up in Orlando with Howard?

swede,

If they end up together, and not here, I'd be alright with the two of them joining Dirk in Dallas.

That'd give mini-Buss agita, I'll bet.

bob

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I was mostly wondering why that isnt being speculated, Orlando has nothing that the Hornets would want?

Maybe the Magic can throw together some kind of package with Nelson that is good enough, I doubt they would want Arenas though.

According to Adrian Wojnarowski of Yahoo Sports (he's often dead on):

The Celtics, Warriors and Clippers are in intense negotiations with NO for Paul. Paul has allegedly told the Warriors and Clips they have a better chance of keeping him longterm if they sign Tyson Chandler.

If we lose Rondo just to have Paul for one year, I'm going to shoot Danny.

Here's hoping Chandler falls in love with Baghdad by the Bay. I have no problem with gutting the current Warrior team if we can add CP3 and Chandler. That's helps my #2 favorite NBA team and won't give me angina about what my #1 favorite NBA team would have to give up for a rental.

bob

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bobheckler wrote:According to Adrian Wojnarowski of Yahoo Sports (he's often dead on):

The Celtics, Warriors and Clippers are in intense negotiations with NO for Paul. Paul has allegedly told the Warriors and Clips they have a better chance of keeping him longterm if they sign Tyson Chandler.

If we lose Rondo just to have Paul for one year, I'm going to shoot Danny.

Here's hoping Chandler falls in love with Baghdad by the Bay. I have no problem with gutting the current Warrior team if we can add CP3 and Chandler. That's helps my #2 favorite NBA team and won't give me angina about what my #1 favorite NBA team would have to give up for a rental.

bob

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Supposedly, the Celtics have offered Rondo, Green and two 1st round picks for Chris Paul.
Why in the world are the Warriors worried about trading for a pg? They have two excellent point guards in Ellis and Curry.
Yes, I know Ellis is more of a shooting guard, but with him and Curry as their guards, they are in great shape.
If Golden State had even a fair center, they would win 5+ more games a year.

swedeinestonia wrote:I was mostly wondering why that isnt being speculated, Orlando has nothing that the Hornets would want?

Maybe the Magic can throw together some kind of package with Nelson that is good enough, I doubt they would want Arenas though.

swede,

Orlando has no players that they could trade which would bring back Chris Paul.
Turkoglu or Nelson are probably their next best players after Howard.

tjmakz wrote:

swedeinestonia wrote:I was mostly wondering why that isnt being speculated, Orlando has nothing that the Hornets would want?

Maybe the Magic can throw together some kind of package with Nelson that is good enough, I doubt they would want Arenas though.

swede,

Orlando has no players that they could trade which would bring back Chris Paul.
Turkoglu or Nelson are probably their next best players after Howard.

And I would say that the same is true for the Lakers more or less.

The Hornets are "ok" with Okafor, getting more bigs for Paul does not make sense. For Orlando Bynum+Gasol/Odom makes sense. From Orlando they might be able to get "several decent players".

BH,

Do you mean you don't think Parish or Walton had decent offensive skills?

Sam

I think Both Orlando and NO are going to make a move before their respective stars take leave.

Both will demand substantial compensation. If DA were able to get Paul and Howard that would be fantastic but I really do not think it will happen.

I think DA is doing more damge to the team by dangling Rondo. If the deal does not go through, Rondo may not be positive for the team. I think that if you want to rebuild an older team you simply have to do it by moving some of your older stars. If you wait too long, those players (PP. RA and KG) will lose even more value. We saw this happen before with the Celtics.

Of course it is difficult to really determine which rumors are true and which are false. But if reports that DA would take a chance of getting CP without him agreeing to an extension and trading RR in the process is true than DA needs to go the the clinic on Monday morning. And even if you got CP3 there is no guarnatee that Howard could also be acquired. I just think this is a real crap shoot.

It will be interesting to see what happens.

dboss

A big problem for the C's is that nobody really wants our aged Big Three, and by Ainge dangling Rondo as trade bait he risks alienation of Rondo. Davis's value has diminished since his Lebron-like disappearance in last years play-offs and the last 1/4 of last regular season. Jeff Green has under-performed since his entrance in Ainge's ill-fated trade with OKC. Delonte West give a reliable performance, when healthy, but not enough for another team to part with serious talent to send Boston's way. Maybe if Ainge were younger, he could assume the Kevin Bacon role in the movie, "The Air Up There," and canvas the jungles of Africa for serious talent to import to make the team in green & white once again the NBA's delight. (LOL)

MD!

sam wrote:BH,

Do you mean you don't think Parish or Walton had decent offensive skills?

Sam

sam,

Ooops. Forgot about Parish.

Big Bill's offensive skills were mostly in the passing arena (one of, if not the best passing centers in the history of the NBA), not scoring, and his scoring dropped as a Celtic. I realize some of that was "The Celtic Way", sublimation of your individual wants to the team's needs, and letting Bird, Wedman, Sichting etal shoot the ball but it was down. In the two years he played for Boston, Walton averaged 7.6 and 2.8 ppg respectively. On a /36mpg basis, he still only averaged 14.1 and 9.0. In his final year, he even had a distinctly bad assist-to-turnover ratio (.9:1.5). Obviously, he stayed one year past his shelf life, since he only played 10 games in that final year.

bob

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tjmakz wrote:

bobheckler wrote:According to Adrian Wojnarowski of Yahoo Sports (he's often dead on):

The Celtics, Warriors and Clippers are in intense negotiations with NO for Paul. Paul has allegedly told the Warriors and Clips they have a better chance of keeping him longterm if they sign Tyson Chandler.

If we lose Rondo just to have Paul for one year, I'm going to shoot Danny.

Here's hoping Chandler falls in love with Baghdad by the Bay. I have no problem with gutting the current Warrior team if we can add CP3 and Chandler. That's helps my #2 favorite NBA team and won't give me angina about what my #1 favorite NBA team would have to give up for a rental.

bob

.

Supposedly, the Celtics have offered Rondo, Green and two 1st round picks for Chris Paul.
Why in the world are the Warriors worried about trading for a pg? They have two excellent point guards in Ellis and Curry.
Yes, I know Ellis is more of a shooting guard, but with him and Curry as their guards, they are in great shape.
If Golden State had even a fair center, they would win 5+ more games a year.

TJ,

Monta Ellis is an athletically gifted ME-baller. I like Curry and have high hopes for him, but a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. I'd give up Ellis or Curry and Biedrins for Chandler and Paul. In fact, I might even give up both guards and Biedrins for those two on longterm contracts. I don't see building around a ME-baller like Ellis or a grape like Biedrins. Curry is a very fine player, like I said I like him, but can you really build around him? You can build around Paul and wingmen to run with him are a dime-a-dozen. Centers that don't trip over their own feet are scarce commodities nowadays, so Chandler would be a big pickup.

bob

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bob,

You can be very successful with "me-ballers" on your team.
(Michael Jordan and Kobe Bryant).
If I was a GS fan, I would want Ellis to shoot the ball as much as he wanted.
The problem with them is that they have had a Don Nelson no-defense mentality as a group.
That didn't work for the Nuggets in the 80's and won't work for GS today.
Biedrins should be an amnesty casualty. He is a pathetic big man with a horrendous contract.
I would not give up Curry and Ellis for Chris Paul.
GS could fix a big part of their problem by keeping their guards and making the highest offer to Chandler.

Latest reports are that San Antonio will use the Amnesty Clause to waive Richard Jefferson.

He still has 3 years, $30M left on his contract.

As long as he's making that money anyway, maybe he'd be willing to come here and play for the vet minimum?

bob

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bobheckler wrote:Latest reports are that San Antonio will use the Amnesty Clause to waive Richard Jefferson.

He still has 3 years, $30M left on his contract.

As long as he's making that money anyway, maybe he'd be willing to come here and play for the vet minimum?

From SI.com. Bold emphasis is mine.

Jefferson now goes into a modified waiver system in which teams under the cap submit bids for him. Any such bidders will name the portion of Jefferson’s salary they’d like to pay; the team that “bids” the highest gets him, pays the bid amount and leaves San Antonio to pay the rest. That team will carry Jefferson for the remaining three seasons on his deal...

If no team under the cap bids on Jefferson, he will be said to have “cleared waivers,” and the rest of the league will get a crack at him. This is where things could get interesting, because a few teams over the cap could use a backup wing player with range and the ability to draw fouls. Boston is starving for a backup wing, the Heat could use some Mike-Miller-injury insurance, and the Thunder (a tad under the cap, actually), if they could wriggle a roster spot free, could us a true small forward to back up Kevin Durant so that they don’t have to play three-guard lineups so often. Even Dallas could use Jefferson to do what Peja Stojakovic did last season...

All of those teams, save for the Thunder, are over the cap once you factor in cap holds (i.e. Marc Gasol), so most of this list is moot should a team under the cap claim Jefferson at any price. Would any team under the cap spend any money on Jefferson, who’s 31, is losing his explosiveness and coming off two seasons in which he struggled (particularly in the playoffs) to grasp things on either end in San Antonio?

http://nba-point-forward.si.com/2011/12/07/so-many-questions-after-spurs-use-amnesty-on-richard-jefferson/

According to Sherrod B., another player on the Celtics radar is Mike Dunleavy Jr., formerly of GSW and Indiana.

Very long at 3, 6'9". Offensively, he has great vision, has good ballhandling skills, is a superior passer, good range on his shot (he shot 40% from 3 last season) and has the kind of basketball IQ you'd expect from the son of a former player and NBA head coach.

Defensively, KG is going to make him cry. A lot.

If Danny is dying for shooters, he might want to take a chance, but we're going to have to surround him with defenders because Dunleavy will get posted up all day and all night. Not just by other 3s and 4s, but by guards. He's soft.

bob

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In "where in the world is Dwight Howard going" news:

http://www.hoopsworld.com/dwight-howard-spells-it-out-for-orlando/

bob

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