Should the Celtics look at Thon Maker?

bobheckler wrote:

arambone wrote:Maker's lower body strength is definitely a concern, and probably for the long term as well.

But from Day One Maker might be the most vertical player in the NBA. He gets up higher than Rudy Gobert, and gets off the ground even quicker. Porzingis might get up as high as Maker does, but probably not. DeAndre Jordan probably gets up as high as Maker, but Maker is much, much more agile in space, and Maker's second jump is much quicker than Jordan's.


Being 7'1" has disadvantages, as Porzingis (7'3") experienced last year. Maker and Porzingis can be out-leveraged by shorter players, and Maker will probably always get out-leveraged in certain situations.

Maker will be outmuscled and look bad on the wrong end of highlight clips, but he should still be able to contest and disrupt shots at the rim after getting backed down and outmuscled.

It will be pretty interesting to watch how Maker's vertical and lateral superiority are counter-balanced by his lack of strength.

His lack of strength may end up pushing him to the bench, perhaps even long-term, unless he proves himself at SF.

But I expect Maker to be a bench superstar early in his career, including his rookie year, and I expect him to put on just enough weight to be a starting PF and superstar within a few years.

arambone,

I think this is a pretty fair summation by you.  His lower body strength is a concern and may always be a concern.  That will effect his stamina and effectiveness.  No legs, no lift.  His has great verticality but his ability to apply it, when he has to get around players who are MUCH stronger and not inclined to make it easy for him to use it, calls into question his effectiveness.  As far as his starting and becoming a superstar goes, well, I'm going to wait to see if these concerns you listed are negligible or overcome before I say that.  He has never laced up an NBA sneaker.


bob


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Most every player has their weaknesses, even LeBron with his jumper the last few seasons.

Sully was remarkably effective most of this season, despite being earthbound and 6'8.5" after part of his spine was removed.

Anthony Davis gets lauded as a great defender despite getting pushed around a lot, and having a very low pain threshhold.

I can see Maker becoming a more 3 point oriented version of Anthony Davis. Maker has at least 3" taller standing reach, and all the athleticism. I see Maker as just about unguardable in the NBA.


Most offensive stars in the NBA, today and in the past, aren't the guys with the highest shooting %s, it's the guys who can get their shot off at will and have the green light from their coach to fire away. Even IT fits that description, but so do most NBA stars.

Maker is already a 79% FT shooter, has talent from as deep as the NBA 3 point line, and I would trust him to take a lot of the shots that end up going to Smart, Crowder, Turner, Sully, Amir, etc.

Maker has that mentality where he thinks every shot is going in. He can and will work on his shot selection, but he's actually a pretty good shooter with a defender right in his face.

I think the NBA game is going to come surprisingly easy to him, and I think his help defense is going to be perhaps the best in the NBA, because Maker is always focused, with his head on a swivel, for the entirety of a defensive possession, all game long. And he's simply just about THE best combination of length and quickness in the NBA on top of that.

If Maker gets backed down and scored on 5 times a game, but plays elite help defense, he'll probably still be an average defender overall, at worst.

Kind of like How Smart almost always makes a significant overall impact even when his shot is way off, or Olynyk still makes a positive impact even when he gets backed down and scored on.

If Thon Maker is relegated to the bench in his first couple years, I think he'll still be a great player in that role. He has the mentality that we all wish Olynyk had, where he fires away aggressively and believes that every shot is going in.

In the Jerebko role, Maker would be just as good as Jerebko even as a rookie, and Jerebko is very good in that bench PF role.

Here's Manute making 6 threes in one quarter

Hey

Why did KG not go to college.

The kids want to make dough$$$$$$$$$$

112288

112288 wrote:Hey

Why did KG not go to college.

The kids want to make dough$$$$$$$$$$

112288

112288,

It was also allowed to go straight from High School to the NBA back then too.


bob


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Saw a slew of articles today saying that the Pistons might be interested in taking Thon at #18. As some of us here predicted, his climb up the board has begun (picture Arambone nodding...). No way this kid lasts until the second round - NBA wouldn't have invited him to the draft. I just hope he lasts until #16.

Here are the links for interested parties:

http://www.nba.com/pistons/features/mystery-man-maker-gives-pistons-something-think-about-18th-pick

http://www.detroitbadboys.com/2016/6/6/11860820/nba-draft-prospects-pistons-workouts-thon-maker

https://pistonpowered.com/2016/04/05/thon-maker-would-be-a-perfect-pick-for-detroit-pistons/

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New Video





bob


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bobheckler wrote:.

New Video





bob


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Notice that the stats DX chose to list are from one full year ago, from some AAU games (EYBL).

That's about the last time DX watched Thon play. They didn't even put these highlights together. Probably didn't even watch them.

I look at 2 things, he is quick and he is athletic.

Draft the kid who is just 19, he is a no brainer !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

112288

This mock has the Celts taking Thon Maker at 23:

http://www.denverstiffs.com/2016/6/16/11952606/stiffs-2016-mock-draft-4-0?hl=1&noRedirect=1

Doug Gottleib from cbs just published his own draft board. Here is the link:

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/doug-gottliebs-nba-draft-big-board-brandon-ingram-doesnt-crack-the-top-2/

He doesn't have Thon Maker in the top 30. Here is his explanation:

Why these players weren't in the top 30:
Thon Maker | C | Australia
Bad hands, no strength, total project, very possibly not an NBA player. Maker is very engaging socially and looks the part in layup lines, but it is hard to improve your hands, hand-eye and strength at the same time.

I'm honestly not even sure who Doug Gottleib is, or if he knows anything, but since we have had so much Maker talk, I thought I'd post this (note: I'm a Maker Fan)

"anywhere from eight to 12"?? Haven't seen anyone else say Maker could go that high.

http://www.si.com/nba/2016/06/17/draft-rumors-latest-trades-stocks-buzz

• The Charlotte Hornets will host Weber State's Joel Bolomboy and Australian Thon Maker in their Pre-Draft workouts tomorrow. A Western Conference scout told Woelfel's Press Box that Maker could go anywhere from eight to 12. The Milwaukee Bucks have also been keeping close tabs on Maker.

Shamrock1000 wrote:Doug Gottleib from cbs just published his own draft board. Here is the link:

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/doug-gottliebs-nba-draft-big-board-brandon-ingram-doesnt-crack-the-top-2/

He doesn't have Thon Maker in the top 30. Here is his explanation:

Why these players weren't in the top 30:
Thon Maker | C | Australia
Bad hands, no strength, total project, very possibly not an NBA player. Maker is very engaging socially and looks the part in layup lines, but it is hard to improve your hands, hand-eye and strength at the same time.

I'm honestly not even sure who Doug Gottleib is, or if he knows anything, but since we have had so much Maker talk, I thought I'd post this (note: I'm a Maker Fan)

I can tell right away that Gottleib hasn't watched Maker play in at least a year, if ever. His little "report" here sounds like an exact regurgitation of what Draft Express has been saying for over a year, with no update based on the whole year that has passed since.

It's just like with all the draft "experts" who sing Bender's praises. They don't know shit about either prospect, but they know how to re-word a scouting report to make it seem like they have an independent opinion.

Doug Gottleib is a moran. All you have to do is watch a couple of his game video's where he had to use superior had eye skills to pass to his teammates while on a full court fast break and visa versa.

Strengthening comes by working with professional NBA conditioning coaches. No college kid walks into the NBA............NBA ready.........there is conditioning improvement needed no matter who.

112288

112288

Check out this new video of Thon Maker's workout yesterday for Charlotte. Charlotte picks 20th, so I'm guessing Maker doesn't have a promise before that, and he very well could be there at 16.

It's a really awesome little video:
http://www.nba.com/hornets/video/2016/06/17/1466183778288-160617-Thon_Highlights.m4v-599890/

Here's that vid I linked to. I love the help-side block at the end. That's going to translate like crazy to the NBA

Who was Thon playing against in Charlotte? They sure made him look good by comparison. He has excellent speed, agility, hand eye coordination, elevation, body coordination. I LIKE this kid a lot. Not #3, but yes, #16.

worcester wrote:Who was Thon playing against in Charlotte? They sure made him look good by comparison. He has excellent speed, agility, hand eye coordination, elevation, body coordination. I LIKE this kid a lot. Not #3, but yes, #16.

Not high school kids.

He's going to look just as good in summer league, and people will still be skeptical but much less so.

He hit 8 out of 10 from 19, missing the first two and then hitting the next 8.

He hit his step up elbow jumpers.

I have NO idea what they were looking for with that baseline drill. Were they really wondering if a 7'+ athlete can dunk an easy alley oop?

The problem with all these videos, not just this one, is that there aren't any obstacles. Mobility drills around chairs or people standing still. Jumpers with nobody running at them to rush their shot. Baseline dunks on perfectly thrown lobs and nobody to have to get around. It's not Maker's fault, of course, but it doesn't show TOO much neither.

And as far as summer league goes if you are a first round draft pick, and you don't show well, you've got problems. RJ Hunter looked amazing in last year's summer league. Marcus Smart was throwing in shots from everywhere. That's because they were playing, mostly, against players that weren't even going to get an invite to a team's camp, much less make the team. The level of competition sucks in summer league.

Still, I'd take him with #16 too. At #16, the chances of getting a game changer isn't that good. There are exceptions, of course, Kawhi Leonard at #14 is a great example but real game changers? Not likely. This Maker kid could be a bust because he's not strong enough to punch his way out of a paper bag and gets thrown around by the power players in the NBA so badly he makes Kelly Olynyk look like Charles Atlas, or he could be that game changer.

If he just turns out to be a solid 20mpg role player, that's not bad for a #16.


bob


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bob


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What excited me about the video was the helpside block at the end.

He might be the best weakside shot blocker in the NBA soon. His length is elite, his agility times were elite, his defensive focus is elite, and his jumping measurements were elite. And of course in high school he was flying all over the place swatting and disrupting shots.

All the defensive things that people praise Bender for, Maker does better. Can't wait to see Maker eat Bender alive next year.

He could give a new meaning to the phrase Sweet Sixteen.

If nothing else this guy if taken at #16 better be better than James Young from day #1.

Interest in Maker has reached the late-lottery stage of Thursday’s draft, and there’s a chance he could go as high as No. 10 to Milwaukee. The Pacers, at No. 20, have strong interest, and one league source described the Indiana pick as Maker’s floor—perhaps fitting, since he listed both Indiana and Notre Dame as two schools he was considering attending.

http://www.sportingnews.com/nba/news/thon-maker-nba-draft-mixtape-australia-south-sudan-ontario-pacers-bucks/10zvz5luexx8z12xvx17f1dz36?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

That (likely false) rumor about Thon being older than listed probably means he'll be there at 16, and maybe even 23 or maybe even 2nd round.

I f'ng knew that the f'ng GMs had VERY different opinions on Thon than the f'ng draftniks.

That's why I f'ing talked about Thon FALLING to 16 (even though some said he couldn't "fall" because he was late 1st at best)


Adrian WojnarowskiVerified account
‏@WojVerticalNBA
Milwaukee plans to select Thon Maker with the No. 10 overall pick, sources tell @TheVertical. GM John Hammond has been enamored with him.

I said Thon could go in the late lotto, might not be there at 16 and said he almost definitely wouldn't be there at 23.

You said Thon was a better prospect than Bender and that scouts/teams were down on him and he was going to drop significantly and teams would find he was not worth a top 10 pick, let alone top 5. Bender still went #4. 

Let's not celebrate too hard arambone. Your Maker love was shared by many here and while your Bender hate was shared by many in the fact that we didn't want him chosen at #3, NOBODY but you thought he could fall out of the top 7-8 and he did not.